Subject: Re: [MDLP-Announce] Carol Moore's Silly Idea and Inconsistency
Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 14:10:44 EDT
From: TsMom17@aol.com
To: crestln@erols.com, MDLP-Announce@yahoogroups.com

In a message dated 8/11/01 1:16:52 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [STEVE SASS] crestln@erols.com writes:

> DON'T LIBERTARIAN'S OPPOSE THE USE OF FORCE ?  MIGHT YOU SAY A FEW WORDS
ON > THAT SUBJECT?  PERHAPS YOU MISSED SOME OF THE FOLLOWING COMMENTS,
INCLUDING > THE ONE BY RON PAUL
> [HAVE YOU HEARD OF HIM OR IS YOUR HEAD SO DEEP IN THE TOILET THAT YOU
> NEITHER SEE LIGHT OR HEAR THE TRUTH:
>
    Geez, can't you make your point without talk like this?

Subject: Re: [MDLP-Announce] Carol Moore's Silly Idea and Inconsistency
Date: Sat, 11 Aug 2001 15:56:03 -0400
From: "steven m. sass" <crestln@erols.com>
Organization: Crestline
To: MDLP-Announce <MDLP-Announce@yahoogroups.com>

>..........Israel our friend?...Read about the U.S.S. Liberty....How soon we
>forget. Besides it's naive to think any country has a true friend!   All countries
>use each other for their needs and wants of the day!
>
>Ginny McDonnell
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT BEFORE YOU OPEN YOUR      , GINNY.

<snip>

Subject: CAROL,YOU USE WORDS LIKE A WHORE USES A LAMP POST -- NOT FOR ILLUMINATION  BUT FOR A PLACE TO MARK YOUR SPOT
Date: Sun, 12 Aug 2001 15:54:07 -0400
From: "steven m. sass" <crestln@erols.com>
Organization: Crestline
To: MDLP-Announce <MDLP-Announce@yahoogroups.com>

SPEAK OUT AGAINST IT OR FOR IT!!!!

WHY DO YOU SAY NOTHING ABOUT INVITATIONS TO ARAFAT AND THE MURDERERS HE WILL NOT CONDEMN OR TURN OVER FOR TRIAL?  HOW ABOUT THE TROOPS WE HAVE FORCED TO WEAR UN UNIFORMS IN SERBIA.

I NEED NOT CHARGE RACISM YOUR WORDS MAKE CLEAR YOUR BIAS.  THIS IS WHAT GETS
THE U.S. AND OTHER COUNTRIES INTO TROUBLE.  I SAY AGAIN, BE CONSISTENT OR BE  QUIET

THE BEAR HALL IS CLOSED!

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Carol Moore wrote:

> Sorry, charging racism or anti-semitism for criticizing Israel doesn't
> intimidate most
> libertarians. We're made of firmer stuff.  And we know and will speak out
> against hypocrisy where
> ever we see it.
>
> "steven m. sass" wrote:
>
> > WHY TAKE ACTION ON ONE COUNTRY, UNLESS YOU HAVE YOUR OWN RACIST MOTIVES!
>
> >
> > YOUR NON LIBERTARIAN PANTIES ARE SHOWING, AND I FIND IT VERY
> UNPLEASANT.  PLEASE GO DOWN WIND!
> >
> > STEVEN SASS

--
Steven M. Sass, President
Crestline Industries
11436 B Cronridge Drive
Owings Mills Md. 21117
410-764-2444
web   http://crestline.netrax.net

---

To: rick@onelilgirl.com
Cc: libs4peace@yahoogroups.com
From: Steven Sass <crestln@erols.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 2003 15:28:32 -0400
Subject: Re: [libs4peace] Re: [MD-lib] Report on Gary Nolan Talk & LP Non-InterventionPolitics

Clearly YOU and people of your persuasion can not think and are not interested in consistency  or logic.

The U.S  and Israel  have NET  Immigrants -- most, if not all of the terror supporting Moslem dominated states have MASS emigration.  Those countries are the precise opposite of Libertarian in that they wish to  control EVERYONE in every way possible, from dress to methods of relaxation.  For those who want to live that way,  let them,  BUT  as a LIBERTARIAN  I  object to anyone who wishes to make me give up alcohol or any personal liberty.  I also have sense enough to see a risk that faces us all:  to paraphrase Paine:: The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will , in this crisis, shrink from the service of  THEIR IDEALS

Neither the U.S. nor Israel  [nor any other GOVERNMENT]  gives its people as much freedom as I think the individuals have a right to, BUT  any Libertarian who supports these FORCE INITIATING organizations in
any way,  is false to his own stated goals

. steve
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Rick LaPoint wrote:

> Apparently Mr. Sass can't read:
>
> (from www.lp.org)
>
> Welcome to the Official Web Site of the Libertarian Party
> The Libertarian Party is committed to America's (note: it doesn't say
> the "world's") heritage of freedom:
>  
> individual liberty and personal responsibility (note: personal, not
> community responsibility as you so sheepishly stated I should seek
> earlier)

---

To: Mike Donovan <mike.donovan@rcn.com>
Cc: libs4peace@yahoogroups.com
From: Steven Sass <crestln@erols.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Jun 2003 13:26:18 -0400
Subject: Re: [libs4peace] Creepy

Gee, creepy, there's a word I have not used since I left elementary school -- is that where you are?  Certainly adds to rational discourse --

Mike,  if you like to throw around loaded phrases like neo-con,  I suspect you will wind up in the same place as carol- and  it is clear   where your thinking leads you,  not me.  For your guidance,  I am a strong Objectivist,  and find the Ayn Rand group way   preferable and more rational than the two of you.

for your closing, Faithful in what?

steve
xxxxxxxx
Mike Donovan wrote:

> Steven Sass wrote to Carol Moore:
>
> "I have no doubt where you will end up, I  just hope it is soon."
>
> What is this creepy Neocon Sass alluding to this time?  Camp Xray?  Hell?
> Murdered?
>
> Sass, you Neocons are a perverted bunch.
>
> Yours Faithfully,
>
> Mike Donovan

---

To: libs4peace@yahoogroups.com
From: Todd Andrew Barnett <libertarianman@comcast.net>
Date: Mon, 16 Jun 2003 15:13:14 -0400
Subject: [libs4peace] My Return to the Libs4Peace List,
    My decision regarding Mr. Steven Sass, etc.

Dear Fellow Libertarians for Peace Members:
<snip>
Third, I've been reading some of the posts made by Mr. Steven Sass and his attitudes with regard to the list. I don't like to take action against people on this list, as it is not my favorite thing to do and I normally don't do that anyway. But considering the responses Mr. Sass has made to this list, especially when he has been a member here since 06/09/03.

Considering the fact that Mr. Sass is basing his views on collectivist government propaganda and machinations, it is quite clear that he is IN FAVOR of our nation's pro-interventionist foreign policy. He has been constantly spewing out globs and globs of collectivist garbage and social engineering on this list, and igniting flames and personal attacks, without having any regard for differences of opinion and without conducting himself in a civilized and dignified manner, even if he disagrees with the LP's position on foreign policy, non-intervention, foreign aid, etc.

Let's all keep in mind that the individual posters who are providing their thoughts and submitting their articles on the list are posting viewpoints which are not a reflection of the non-intervention and anti-war positions that are a centerpiece of Libertarians for Peace. Furthermore, the thoughts, ideas, and views of the individual posters are in no way endorsed and/or supported by the national Libertarians for Peace organization and all or any of its affiliates.

In other words, the ideas given by the posters are merely their own and do not exclusively represent the positions of the national organization itself.

Because of Mr. Sass' behavior and his abusive and childish behavior, I have come to a decision. It is not one that I make lightly, and it is one that I have to make. Ergo my decision is this:

In light of the statements made by Mr. Sass and his outrageous and idiotic behavior, it is apparent to me that he has abused his membership in the organization and he has initiated force to a calculating attempt to achieve his own goals. Ergo, because of these actions and his behavior, I have decided that he is to be banned from this list on a permanent basis. I could have moderated him for his unethical, morally-bankrupt, and outrageous behavior, but what would be the point? It would probably drive him away from the list. And I would rather have that happen quickly than allow him to be a member of the group.

He has worn out his welcome; ergo he is no longer welcome in Libs4Peace. It's that simple.
<snip>
{Note: Since Mr. Barnett no longer was owner of the list, I as the new owner only MODERATED Sass, per the requests of a number of members. He then quit the list.  After increasingly insulting emails on other lists, I then banned him.  C. Moore]

---

Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2003 15:34:09 -0400
From: Steven Sass <crestln@erols.com>
To: Carol Moore <info@carolmoore.net>
Subject: Ding Dong the witch is gone!

Other than a bloodied suicide note,  I can't think of anything I would rather read from you carol!

Steve,  Baltimore
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Carol Moore wrote:

> snip 

---

To: Libertarian@yahoogroups.com
From: "Terry L Parker" <txliberty@yahoo.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Aug 2003 22:43:53 -0000
Subject: [Libertarian] MODERATORintervention re: Reply to 2nd Mercer Screed Against Libertarians

Steven Sass, you're on 'moderated' status AGAIN!

Go back and read the warnings from the last time that you were moderated to gain better insights about why it's happening to you again.  You are not 'banned'  Your messages to this forum will languish in a que awaiting my review BEFORE publication in this forum at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian

Please consult this forum's guidlines in the 'files' area for more info.

Moderator,
-Terry Liberty Parker
http://profiles.yahoo.com/txliberty


--- In Libertarian@yahoogroups.com, Steven Sass <crestln@e...> wrote:
> to have a rational discussion one must deal with a rational being --
you
> are neither
>
> you really seam to be into this 'sucking thing carol'  -- please
keep
> your private income source to yourself, paltry though it must be!
>
> what rumors are you starting about FairTax -- that is no rumor, I
am
> regional director of the most positive practical way to abolish the
> IRS,   or is the income tax one of your  pets?
>
>
> Steve Sass,  Baltimore
>
> P.S.    I will put my record  for liberty and freedom against yours
> anytime -- your lack of knowledge and personal bias is so appalling
to
> me, that you might like to know  EVERY TIME you issue a stupid
> statement,  I send a PERSONAL contribution to Israel!  Speak up
again,
> you ignorant mass of  protoplasm!
<snip>

---

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JewishLibertarians/message/3607
From:   Steven Sass <crestln@e...>
Date:  Thu Aug 14, 2003  6:18 am
Subject:  Re: [JewishLibertarians] Libertarians who loathe Israel

carol moore is the ex participant, BUT if you ever have the misfortune to read messages on Lib4peace, SOME of them sound like martin borman, eichman or others --- AMAZINGLY scary, and enough to raise real concerns in my mind about the hidden agenda of a lot of people -- I also obtained an additional fire arm specifically because of what I read there, AND I have been told by some friends in the WDC area, that the statements sometimes uttered in private in that area are just as bad

Steve Sass, Baltimore

---

To: MD-lib@yahoogroups.com, md-lib-news@yahoogroups.com
From: Steven Sass <crestln@erols.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 10:42:44 -0500
Subject: Re: [MD-lib] Re:  Libertarian strategy to be developed]
<snip>
I wouldn't give YOU anything but the web site for the Hemlock Society
<snip>

---

To: "Steve --Baltimore" <crestln@erols.com>
Cc: "MDdiscuss" <MD-lib@yahoogroups.com>,
        "MDLib-NEWS" <md-lib-news@yahoogroups.com>,
        "Individual Sovereignty" <individual-sovereignty@yahoogroups.com>
From: "Ed Akehurst" <taxtruth@comcast.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2003 10:25:42 -0500
Subject: [MD-lib-News] Is the flaming really necessary? Grow up.

Steve,

Please read carefully the below quotes. Each of them came from you and were
publicly directed at Carol Moore. The fact that you disagree with her
ideology does not make it right or correct for you to make such childish
attacks against her. This does not bode well for the newcomer who checks out
these lists to see what Libertarianism is all about. These issues CAN be
discussed intelligently and rationally (even if vehemently) without the
personal attacks tossed in. This is VERY kindergarten-school-yard garbage.

You are the MEMBERSHIP COORDINATOR? I am ashamed to belong to a group who
chose to fill one of it's leadership and outreach positions with someone who
behaves so immaturely in public.

I have thought long and hard about leaving the Party for many months now.
You have shored up my decision to stop assisting the party. Over the years,
I have dedicated many hours to obtaining petition signatures, manning booths
at fairs, doing highway cleanup, putting together databases, organizing
county LP organizations, etc.

I am not leaving the Party because of your behavior, but you have made me
realize that my decision to leave is the correct choice and I will certainly
never come back to the fold until you are no longer in any official
leadership position.

Grow up.

Ed Akehurst

Quotes (made in a public forum) towards another human being from Steve Sass,
the LP Membership Coordinator - PAY ATTENTION PEOPLE - THIS IS WHAT THE
WORLD SEES AS THE LP:

“you have shown do not have the necessary tools to read a  book much less a
mind”

“YOU toss out bigoted stupid statements that drive people away”

“my insults are directed at YOU -- the dumbest shrew I have ever had the
misfortune to encounter!”

“you get dumber with every post”

“Perhaps you need to have some fanatic shove a bomb up your......,  but
if you used your head for anything beyond a rest place for pigeons”

“If only someone would toss  water on you so you would melt away”

---

To: MD-lib@yahoogroups.com
From: ronkean@juno.com
Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2003 00:41:55 -0500
Subject: [MD-lib] Re: Is the flaming really necessary?

On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 10:52:57 -0500 Carol Moore in DC
<news@carolmoore.net> writes:
> Thanks, Ed, for commenting on the plethora of ad hominems.  I have
> tried
> to refrain from such, except to point out, for example, when Sass's
> > views were more like a NEOCONs than a libertarians.  Perhaps it is
> time > for moderator action?
>

I appreciate, Carol, that you have refrained from responding in kind to the recent rash of personal comments.

At this point, it is my duty as moderator to place the following address on moderation: crestln@erols.com . [STEVE SASS] This action applies only to the MD-lib discussion list.

I believe that it is possible to disagree, even profoundly so, and yet still be polite, and that the consensus of members of this list supports the rule that discussion here should remain in a civil tone.

Ron Kean
moderator, MD-lib@yahoogroups.com

---

To: MD-lib@yahoogroups.com
From: cboxall@bigfoot.com
Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2003 22:57:10 -0000
Subject: [MD-lib] [MD-lib-News] Re: 2002 LP PLatform on Foreign Policy

  A variety of thoughts on this -

First and foremost -
"carol --you get dumber with every post --"

and

" Perhaps you need to have some fanatic shove a bomb up your......, but if you used your head for anything beyond a rest place for pigeons <snip> "

  These comments are inappropriate, regardless of anything Carol might have said.  If her comments were truly of no value, it wouldn't make sence to respond to them.  That out of the way . . . .
<snip>